Anrio Adams = Ready to Roll

[kuballin10]

Originally Posted by rostarun

I hate the phrase "can score at will", if the person really could score at will why wouldn't they just do that and never lose a game. It's almost as bad as "will to win", Sherron had so much will to win he just "wouldn't let us lose" which assumes that when we did lose it was because he allowed it to happen.

Off topic but....speaking of the scoring at will.

Read on article on espn about how viewers the past few year were like "man, lebron should take it to the whole everytime no one could stop him."

Well looks like he figured that out this year.

The next 6-8 years could be scary.

[lMrokkenAmullet]

Originally Posted by fplvieyra

For me, the 2008 team didn't have a "star" front court player because all of the front court players were so talented/skilled and so bought into a team philosophy that none of them really outshined the others. I'm not sure that would be the case with Ellis, Traylor, Peters and Lucas. While I think all of them will be solid, I'm not sure there will be as small a gap between Ellis and the other players as there was between the 2008 players that year. That isn't to say that they won't be formidable individually or together, just that I'd feel more comfortable if there was another clearly top-flight front court player to cycle in and out of the lineup.

Arthur was easily the star of that group. he was the most highly rated out of HS (RSCI #11) by far, over Jackson (#68) and Kaun (#43). not only that, but he was 2nd in RPG, PPG, and 1st in BPG.

Ellis is easily the highest rated of the group (of true post players, which doesn't include White), and he should be higher than his ranking ended up. i don't believe any of the other guys (Lucas, Peters, Traylor) will be as successful as Ellis will be. though, i hope i'm wrong on that, as i'd love for all of them to be hugely successful.

[Studku]

None of our other freshman gaurds played as poor as tharpe and got to start some day other than senior night at ku. The others transfered

[UNTHAWK]

I can understand the hopes that Tharpe succeeds, b/c he is a Jayhawk. I mean, no one on here wants him to fail. But the reality is, if you put RR as a freshman on last years team, he would have gotten a ton more PT. That doesnt mean Im hating on Tharpe. That doesnt mean I hope he fails. I actually like him in his interviews. He seems charismatic and thoughtful. But HCBS didn't trust him to give TT rest even when Tyshawn told Coach Self that he was exhausted during conf. Are we going to ignore this?

Now a reasonable response would be something like, "You can't measure how much he'll improve" and that's valid. But guess what, everyone else is improving also. Unless he improves leaps and bounds before next season, he could still not be good enough. Again, I hope he succeeds, but I dont think it's likely. He's getting recruited over for a reason.

[rbird]

Originally Posted by UNTHAWK

I can understand the hopes that Tharpe succeeds, b/c he is a Jayhawk. I mean, no one on here wants him to fail. But the reality is, if you put RR as a freshman on last years team, he would have gotten a ton more PT. That doesnt mean Im hating on Tharpe. That doesnt mean I hope he fails. I actually like him in his interviews. He seems charismatic and thoughtful. But HCBS didn't trust him to give TT rest even when Tyshawn told Coach Self that he was exhausted during conf. Are we going to ignore this?

Now a reasonable response would be something like, "You can't measure how much he'll improve" and that's valid. But guess what, everyone else is improving also. Unless he improves leaps and bounds before next season, he could still not be good enough. Again, I hope he succeeds, but I dont think it's likely. He's getting recruited over for a reason.

He'e fine and Tyshawn played out of his mind last big 12 season that is why Tharpe didn't play. The way Tyshawn played last season RR as a freshmen on last years team wouldn't have gotten anymore playing time than tharpe did I call major bull shit on that. Tyshawn was our leader last year I don't care how good T-Rob was and Self knew he needed him in there basically the entire game every game.

[rbird]

And if you don't want to take my word for it ask Matt, He dominated the scrimmages and Bill Self said it himself when introducing tharpe: "This guy right here is from the highly regarded brewster academy. He is a stud and is going to be a huge part of our team this next season and the rest of his career at kansas."

[UNTHAWK]

Originally Posted by rbird

He'e fine and Tyshawn played out of his mind last big 12 season that is why Tharpe didn't play. The way Tyshawn played last season RR as a freshmen on last years team wouldn't have gotten anymore playing time than tharpe did I call major bull shit on that. Tyshawn was our leader last year I don't care how good T-Rob was and Self knew he needed him in there basically the entire game every game.

What are you calling bullshit on? TT telling Self he was exhausted? I can find the article to prove it to you. Logic and reasoning makes it easy to understand why, "Self knew he needed him in there basically the entire game". He needed him in there the entire game b/c he had no legitimate backup. That should be a simple concept to grasp. Are you also forgetting the interview Self gave saying, if guys cant get time this year when we have no bench, then theyre gonna have a tough time getting it next season? I dont care how well a player is playing, if theyre exhausted you give them a rest. UNLESS, your backups dictate that you can't do that.

Coach Self admitted during interviews in the postseason that TT being tired played a role in his turnovers. Dont you think he would have liked to give him a break, so he was fresher late in game and late in the season? Come on Rbird, no one on this board wants to see Tharpe fail. But you gotta open your eyes, my man. All the signs are pointing towards him getting replaced.

[UNTHAWK]

Originally Posted by rbird

And if you don't want to take my word for it ask Matt, He dominated the scrimmages and Bill Self said it himself when introducing tharpe: "This guy right here is from the highly regarded brewster academy. He is a stud and is going to be a huge part of our team this next season and the rest of his career at kansas."

Ill state it again, I hope Naadir Tharpe is successful at the University of Kansas. Ive never stated otherwise. But Im not stupid, I can see the kid didnt get time on the worst bench we've ever had. And you can lose the dominating scrimmages argument w/ me. Doesn't Justin Wesley play well in scrimmages also?

Bottom line: this debate is worthless. Im willing to wait until Oct. and Nov. come around to see how it all plays out. They'll settle it on the court.

[fplvieyra]

Originally Posted by lMrokkenAmullet

Arthur was easily the star of that group. he was the most highly rated out of HS (RSCI #11) by far, over Jackson (#68) and Kaun (#43). not only that, but he was 2nd in RPG, PPG, and 1st in BPG.

Ellis is easily the highest rated of the group (of true post players, which doesn't include White), and he should be higher than his ranking ended up. i don't believe any of the other guys (Lucas, Peters, Traylor) will be as successful as Ellis will be. though, i hope i'm wrong on that, as i'd love for all of them to be hugely successful.

Arthur clearly was the most athletic and clearly had the most potential. But in terms of what the front court players actually did on the court that year, they were pretty similar, straight-up and on a per-minute basis. Comparing Arthur to Jackson straight-up since they played similar minutes per game (24.7 for Arthur, 24.3 for Jackson), you see that they had similar ppg (12.8 for Arthur, 11.2 for Jackson) and rpg (6.3 for Arthur, 6.8 for Jackson). The only notable difference was that Jackson was more efficient scoring (with a .626 shooting percentage vs. .543 for Arthur). When you compare Arthur to Kaun and Aldrich and adjust on a per-minute basis, there wasn't much, if any, drop off either. Like I mentioned earlier, this was because that team overall was incredibly balanced at a high level and played well as a group. 7 players averaged more than 7 ppg (with the high being only 13.3) and 6 players averaged more than 3 rpg (with the high being only 6.7).

That aside, I think we're pretty much on the same page.

[fplvieyra]

Originally Posted by UNTHAWK

What are you calling bullshit on? TT telling Self he was exhausted? I can find the article to prove it to you. Logic and reasoning makes it easy to understand why, "Self knew he needed him in there basically the entire game". He needed him in there the entire game b/c he had no legitimate backup. That should be a simple concept to grasp. Are you also forgetting the interview Self gave saying, if guys cant get time this year when we have no bench, then theyre gonna have a tough time getting it next season? I dont care how well a player is playing, if theyre exhausted you give them a rest. UNLESS, your backups dictate that you can't do that.

Coach Self admitted during interviews in the postseason that TT being tired played a role in his turnovers. Dont you think he would have liked to give him a break, so he was fresher late in game and late in the season? Come on Rbird, no one on this board wants to see Tharpe fail. But you gotta open your eyes, my man. All the signs are pointing towards him getting replaced.

I think it was pretty clear that Self kept Taylor in so much because he was a scoring threat. He and Robinson were the only consistent offensive threats we had. Releford, Johnson, Withey, and Young all had a few great games, but in no way could they or anyone else on the roster carry the team offensively over the year like Taylor and Robinson. In other words, what Self really needed last year to back up Taylor wasn't a pure, pass-first point guard like Tharpe was coming out of high school. That won't be the situation going forward, however, so Tharpe should see many more minutes and be able to play to his strengths more.

[rbird]

I'm done arguing and I want to make myself clear. I would LOVE for Rio or Doyle to play more than Tharpe because I think they're more exciting to watch and have more athletic potential but I still think Tharpe will hog the majority of the minutes over the next few years at the 1 spot and I'm guessing he'll do more than fine.

[kuballin10]

Originally Posted by rbird

And if you don't want to take my word for it ask Matt, He dominated the scrimmages and Bill Self said it himself when introducing tharpe: "This guy right here is from the highly regarded brewster academy. He is a stud and is going to be a huge part of our team this next season and the rest of his career at kansas."

Yes, HCBS did say this and also said stuff about merv that we all see didn't pan out.

HCBS isn't going to say....tharpe is a great kid, loves kansas, but doesn't play good enough D or is quick enough to play here.

This isn't my opinion of tharpe but it's not something you will ever hear him say. He will be positive and fudge the truth a little to make our players seem better at times.

[Biker]

+1

Originally Posted by CalHawk

I will not, for the life of me, understand "Jayhawk fans" who think it is not only necessary, but somehow their duty, to make sweeping and uncomplimentary remarks about players with no consideration about the maturation process that goes on over the course of a career at KU. I mean, I look forward to watching these kids develop and eventually shine. To me, that's part of the enjoyment of being a KU fan. But, now you have these "fans" who think its their job to determine which ones are worth riding in the derby and which are destined for the glue factory. Its absolutely disgusting.

What is it about human nature that one can't make an honest assement or criticism without making sweeping and unfair remarks about others? What's more, I've seen this done over and over with players that ended up being pretty good and accomplishing great things for our school. Sasha Kahn, Darnell Jackson, Russel Robinson, The Twins, TT. All of these players had their own issues to work through, all of them had "fans" saying in some form or another how they would never contribute something meaningful, and yet, we keep on winning at record paces.

This idea that college productivity and specialness is only valued in relation to NBA draft stock is absolutely disgusting. There's nothing wrong with saying you believe one player's talent will eventually win out over another's, but its a completely different thing to talk about "how so-and-so will never see the floor/never start/will probably transfer". Its an unnecessary conversation and it was said about all the players listed above. I remember people being so outraged about the Twins they wanted Self to boot them. Everyone was sure RR was going to transfer, etc.

They're Jayhawks for crying out loud, and you guys aren't scouts.